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New to Drupal? A word from the wise: Never say newbie!
Submitted by Aaron on Mon, 02/09/2009 - 15:50
I have nothing against new Drupal users on Drupal.org, even the most advanced Drupal developers were new to Drupal at one point or another, but I have seen a pattern among certain new users that drives me crazy. In fact it drove me crazy back even when I was new to Drupal myself: the abuse of the term newbie.
Ok I admit that that sounds like a pretty weird thing to say, but I have a well formulated psychological analysis to back me up. Hear me out people.
So many times on issue queues or in forums I have seen users introduce themselves timidly as a newbie before presenting their question. Sometimes their questions are perfectly valid and aren't really "Newbie" questions at all, but the by introducing themselves as newbies right off the bat they influence the way I read their post, and whether they know it or not, it doesn’t influence it in a good direction.
Why? You ask. Why would announcing one's self as a newbie have a negative impact on the reception of your post? I'll tell you why:
Most of the time when people call themselves a newbie it is to protect themselves from receiving a curt response from the module maintainer or whoever is being addressed, or in order to attain their sympathy. It's kind of like dogs who take the strategy of playing submissive in order to avoid trouble. I guess there isn't anything fundamentally wrong with that approach if that’s what flips your noodle, but the problem is that many will use this to avoid taking responsibility.
By taking responsibility I am referring to making every reasonable effort to educate yourself before trying to appeal for help. Read the documentation! If you haven't even read the documentation and you are posting a question about how to use a module the problem isn't that you are new, the problem is that you are LAZY, and putting the newbie disclaimer before a post does not negate that fact.
No one is born a Drupal developer; no one is born a programmer, or a themer. Those of us that made it past the novice stage are the ones that took it upon themselves to study the online documentation for Drupal, to buy and read books on Drupal, to study the source code, etc... There is a learning curve, no way around it. That curve is overcome only when you make friends with Google and start reading.
I guess the essence of what I am getting at is that when someone calls themselves a newbie it comes across as saying "Please have pity on me. Come hold my hand and walk me through this step by step for free. I am incapable of learning this without your merciful guidance." That approach bugs me, and I'm not the only one.
If you have made every reasonable effort, if you have read the documentation, looked through the issue queues, Googled every reasonable word combination related to your question and you still can't find an answer by all means post the question, but don't use the term newbie. It's really not necessary. If you did the things I just mentioned and you still haven't found an answer then chances are your question is perfectly valid, and you should have enough self respect to let your question stand on its own without a disclaimer. But hey, that's just my opinion.
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You've changed my thinking...
The post is appreciated because I have made forum post announcing myself as a newbie. Although I had read the documentation for the particular modules in question and searched the Internet for a solution to my question, I started with 'Newbie here.'
Maybe it is a matter of insecurity that causes one to use the term 'newbie', but learning Drupal is like learning a new language. What you say sounds correct to you, but to a native speaker they have trouble understanding what you say.
From my perspective Drupal is beyond any other program of its type and have recommended it to seasoned WordPress users who need greater capability. So far every one of them have reported back that the learning curve is steep and have decided to live with WP's limitations.
Perhaps the Drupal forum needs to start a newbie section. A sticky post could tell the poster the steps you've outlined for researching a solution before posting. If they don't make the effort their question is unlikely to be answered.
For some a separate newbie category will seem silly and coddle to the lazy. There is truth in what they say. However, there is a benefit to both the regular posters and the newbie. First, it corals the newbies where they can feel 'safe'. Second, it reduces the amount of post in the rest of the forum.
Anyway, it's just a thought.
I think new people should mingle
I really hope I didn't come across as attacking new users. I really think new people can and should mix in the normal forums. I think it's just a question of perspective. I was a "Newbie" to Drupal two years ago, but I would never announce it. I just did my best to formulate questions that made sense. However, the truth is the forums didn't help much for the most difficult aspects of Drupal. To really get Drupal you have to really understand php and CSS which requires a lot of outside studying and practice.
I think the real point I was trying to make is that new users should not hide behind their newness. Have confidence in yourself and ask the question without disclaimers.
Completely Agree
Actually, your post was helpful. It pushed me from the shallow end of the pool and into the deep end.
I agree with what you've said. The reason for suggesting a 'newbie' section is that Drupal requires acquisition of a new lexicon and there are times a poster doesn't know the terminology or have mastered the process, which makes them unsure of how to ask their question.
I see what you're saying
It's true that there are a lot of things that the lofty geniuses explain very very poorly. They take things for granted when making explanations that they really shouldn't. I say "they", but I guess I am probably just as guilty at this point. It's hard to bridge the gap and remember that saying things like "you just need to override the theme function" are not normal English.
agree, but...
Hi my names jeff and i'm a drupal newbie (just kidding, but i am acutally).
Looking at the drupal support page, you've got:
"Get Help - Help, meet, chat, discuss, and learn even more in the forums"
Its not until you check the tips that you read:
"Please see the handbook."
I see two issues, the people that try to fix issues thru support/forums without doing the 1st level troubleshooting. If you've not worked on a first level IT support desk and been taught all the steps to troubleshoot, then how are you supposed to know what the process for troubleshooting is. The tips say:
"demonstrate a willingness and capability to help yourself"
Some people dont know how to help themselves and thats why they end up in the forum. Maybe at the the start of your posts aaron you could have text that says "have you tried this" and link to a page running them thru all the first level steps, then add your comments after that.
2nd issue - I think people announcing newbie is more about them trying to explain a level of comprehension to other people in forum. Perhaps a field that says "jeff has been a member for 4 years" would help solve that one (or 4 minutes as the case may be). Also i would like to take drupal certification, but doesnt appear to be any, would be good to show to customers and might help in establishing levels of understanding in forums.
Finally (and i can hear the boo's now) it might be easier for some people to use forum to find answers to simple issues using forums than trying to search thru the doco which isnt always easy... its happened to me recently where i've gone searched thru google b4 reading the doco and come up with the answer quicker than going thru doco. without newbie posts this wouldnt have happened.
Actually i just dislike the word newbie i think, its the sound of it thats irratating! arrrrrrrhhhh! - its good to have a vent once in a while!
Cheers
Jeff
True, true
Yeah, it's true the Drupal.org site is currently a pain to navigate. I get lost there myself sometimes. Hopefully the redesign that is in progress will fix some of that.
As for the word "Newbie"... yes, for me I think I find the sound of the word irritating as well. It's too cutsie... I would associate it with a brand of pink stuffed animals with bambi eyes if I didn't know better. The word "beginner" is much less bothersome, but at the same time I still think it is better to not announce your newness on every post.
One thing I think that would help is if they had a two stage process for submitting issues or forums that required the user to see a set of links to documentation and confirm that they had already gone through that stage. On issue queue of my modules I often get reports from people who clearly didn't even read the project page for the module... soooo frustrating. But I digress, that will have to be a subject for another rant.
Agreed both Aaron & Jeff
Hi Aaron, I am also a newbie to drupal LOL. Anyway I agreed in both you and Jeff in some points.
I agreed what Jeff mentioned that we who called ourself "newbie" is just a way to explain to people the level of comprehension on drupal. but anyway, I really appreciate about your post that it has changed the way I think on learning the web development and drupal.
I think I should start everything from basic and spend more time on the fundamental knowledge such as css & php and also on the drupal documentation before I will go any further.
Cheers,
Harry
The irony
It's funny... I didn't think I would attract so many new users to this post. I guess I should have considering the provocative nature of the title.
One thing I would say to you Harry is that you shouldn't necessarily just switch full out to studying books and stop building sites. I for one started off just doing the administration and theming (and I didn't buy a book for a long time). The theming part of Drupal takes quite a bit of learning, but at the same time it provides a structure that will work even while your skills are developing. That is to say, you won't necessarily be able to do everything you want to do when you are starting out, but if you meet those challenges on the field, and stubbornly push forward, the book knowledge will become much more relevant.
My standpoint is that the best way to learn is to start building a site on your own, but with a set of books by your side. Then as you encounter issues start looking for the answers in the text and online. Much of what you have to learn isn't written out clearly in any book that I have found yet. A lot of it has to do with recognizing patterns and troubleshooting odd issues that come up when trying to make a site look and act how you intend it to.
You should expect many hours of frustration and confusion... these are the dues we pay to own the skills, but if you get it down it can be a very lucrative career (or money saving hobby). My honest opinion is that from Newbie to master developer there are about 1 - 2 years of struggle (unless you are already coming from a programming background).
Starting out
I am a ecclectic person. Curious is probably the best way to describe me...wait- hold that, impatiently curious.
I came to Drupal because the site I developed with a programmer (I had the creative side, structure development- without the programming knowledge) was outgrowing his independent design skills and DRUPAL, when I found it, was like the holy grail.
The problem is- and has been for me- that a little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing. IT can get you started- then get you into trouble- especially when you are not a "linear learner" (I like to run before I walk).
This is my baggage, but that being said, I have found myself having tons of success addressing problems I encounter while I stumble and bumble around my development process by searching the web- (I do this first before using the DRUPAL help because the DRUPAL pages drive me nuts and the language is beyond my color of green).
Wishing I knew how to do stuff- well it aint gonna get it done...thats the 99% perspiration part.
I am on my own now, trying to develop and launch several websites....without the help of a programmer---so pray for me.
I will admit, the biggest challenge for me is letting go of the static old approach and philosphy to website structure. The forward thinking and flexible dynamic nature of Drupal blows my mind and I just hope that one day I have enough to develop a site from start to finish without all the bruises.
Thanks for your site...it is one I have in my toolbox.
Spherical is the way to go
Hi Caroline,
I think you'll do well with Drupal if you keep at it. Just the will to jump into it and try stuff that will get you into trouble will take you far. And don't sell yourself short on programming either. You would be surprised how fast it can start clicking after you've reached a certain level of saturation.
The Complexity Of Programming Languages
Hi Aaron,
I answer for myself and perhaps for many others learning drupal or any new applications.
Searching for answers in public forums is often a hit or miss process. Usually one finds a partial answer and continues to sieve through a forum. The bigger the forum, the wilder the search for an answer. The newer one is, the longer and more winding and widening the effort becomes. Sometimes I ask a simple question hoping for a simple explanation. However, there are MANY experts who give explanations that I don't understand. Their answers contain terms such as stack-overflow, ZZIM, memory-conflict, etc etc. These terms drive me crazy, as the word 'newbie' drives you crazy.
Therein lies the simple reason I qualify myself as a newbie when I ask for an answer from the world who do not know me at all.
I believe drupal is one of
I believe drupal is one of the most popular content management systems used across the web. The Drupal content management system can be used to power many different types of websites including resource, portal, small business, educational and e-commerce websites.
That's why I'm getting to love it!
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